Iran

Talitha Tetelestai · Guest

Is everyone being held in Guantanamo Bay a terrorist?

I thought not. Icon_sad

Were they all treated well?

I didn't think the answer to that was yes either. Icon_sad

I don't think the captured seamen and woman will be physically harmed, but they are undoubtedly being mentally damaged by the experience.

I do think they will eventually be released.

Should we go to war over it?

Depends if you think dead Iranians and more dead British soldiers will solve anything (2 or 3 more dead in the last few days, one seriously injured, soldiers going AWOL all over the place because they are literally TERRIFIED to go back to Iraq, all of whom are somebodys son or father or husband or brother, most batallions now operating on an 18 month cycle - 6 month tour of Iraq - 6 month normal duties - 6 month training to go to Iraq - 6 month in Iraq..etc..etc).

If anybody seriously thinks we need to start another conflict I'd be more inclined to take your opinion without a pinch of salt if you really knew what the current one is doing to the army, and if you were genuinely facing the loss of someone you love in that conflict.

Did you know that the british army is pulling out of Bosnia?

Often they had men working with them as interpreters who definitely played some part in the atrocities there..it is well known that those self same interpreters warned soldiers that when the army pulls out of Bosnia the killing will all start over again, because the hatred against each other is still in the hearts of the people..

We go round the world getting involved in all these things, 6 month projects that turn into 25 years of commitment only to flare up again the moment we leave and meantime hundreds of soldiers are dead and forgotten.

By all means go start a war in Iran and watch the bodies pile up again and feel glad that we got involved when your son/brother/father/husband sleeps safe at night (I hope you can sleep at night too).

It's easy to wave a flag and cheer the boys on when the personal cost is zero.

We aren't God, we will not eradicate the evil that men do, and we should not be chasing these things unless there is a serious unresolvable need.

Take a deep breath and think, for goodness sake!

VictoriaPlum · Joined: 16 Jan 2007 Posts: 718

Oh no, I hope there is no war, I want no troops sent in. You'd think these stupid politicians would have learned from the last, and current, fiasco.

I do pray that the captured seamen are released soon.

keepingthefaith · Guest

I don't think there will be a Middle East war in Iran...yet.
I think if we take Oil out of the equasion and Bushes grievances with Saddam, taking democracy to Nations who are extreme in there religion is a complete waste of time, our type of freedom (to them) is unGodly and abhorant, also the way Iraq has panned out i would say the people were better of with Saddam, sad this is to say i'm afraid. He did manage to keep control of this people and Nation and I believe freedom of the kind we want to impose on the Iraqi people is not the type of freedom they want Icon_1435

Infact I would say these people are Muslim first and Iraqi second (if asked) and these peoples rules and lives are lived by violence, there laws remain violent. It is ok for the minority Iraqi to sit in London with a collar and tie and say what he would like for his country but the fact is that 99% do not want the Western freedom that Britain and America and the rest of the European Countries have.
What was that sayng
East is east and west is west and neither the twain shall meet.

I'll get of my soap box now

keepingthefaith · Guest

BTW just reading your post again TT truly heartfelt Icon_hugginsmileys_753

jtheb · Joined: 21 Jun 2006 Posts: 1448 Location: second childhood

Janie · Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2007 3:12 pm Post subject:

well perhaps there is something to *diplomacy* after all..it seems as though the 15 British personnel are to be released and will fly back to the UK tomorrow. Thank God for that.
Perhaps we (The British) are not so *despised* as the Americans after all.....I think it was something like 440 days before the American hostages were released from Tehran back in 1981.

bobbyc · Joined: 23 Sep 2006 Posts: 1324

I think you'll find that some Iranian prisoners are also being released. Not that this is an official exchange of prisoners you understand.

John, I have no idea what is in your mind until you speak it.

bobbyc · Joined: 23 Sep 2006 Posts: 1324

Just heard on the radio news that the fifteen sailors and marines will be released tomorrow. "As a gift to Britain" according to the Iranian President.

Eddie c · Joined: 16 Sep 2006 Posts: 685 Location: Manchester

This was always going to happen. What is amazing is the way these marines made the comments they did. What happened to saying nothing?.

Well at least we are not going to Carpet Bomb Iran Icon_happythumbsup

_________________
One thing i do know.I was blind but now i see.

Eddie c · Joined: 16 Sep 2006 Posts: 685 Location: Manchester

I have just watched the prisoners? in thier nice suits being interviewed. They say they have been treated really well. Now the Politicians will be jumping on the bandwagon claiming a victory. To be honest i have seen groups of people coming back from Benidorm looking worse for wear.

Just for the record can i say that i am not a pacifist. My grandfather aged 35 with a large family joined the British Army in WW1 and went to the killing fields. All the young men were dead so it was a case of everyone must go. He was badly wounded and was brought home to die with his family. He died a terrible death leaving his wife and children destitute. I have Newspaper clippings about his funeral. He had a military funeral and is buried in a military grave in Tipperary.

My father was refused service in WW2. He came to England with his new wife and worked in Birmingham doing `needed` work. My eldest sister was born in Birmingham. After the war they returned to Ireland and i came along later.

I have many cousins who moved to England and done thier Military service. My cousin Bill saw some heavy action and has the medals to show for it.

Had i been around in the last War i would definetly have joined up and fought against Hitler .
My wifes father was a boy sailor. He was brought up in an orphanage and joined the Navy aged i think fourteen. He spent the war years on minesweepers. He was at Dunkirk and saw terrible sights.

I admire those men who were willing to sacrifice all for the sake of liberty.

What really annoys me is the way they are treated afterwards. There is all this fuss about these 15 sailors. They will be feted and seen as heroes. I think they acted poorly. They should have said nothing,told the Iranians to take a hike. Name -rank and serial number,thats your lot.

You know every week soldiers return to this Country from Iraq and Afghanistan,many of them minus limbs and badly wounded. Many are mentally scarred and will never recover. Not a word about these poor souls. The government has even tried to hide the true figures as to how many are wounded. Its a scandal that these men and women cannot even get the medical treatment they need. They feel abandoned by thier government.

Its always been this way. I read recently that over 200 servicemen who fought in the Falklands have committed suicide. Remember Gulf-war syndrome. Hundreds of soldiers in a desperate state denied the help they needed.

I would fight to defend my family and do so if this Country was attacked. But as for getting involved in other peoples Countrys at the whims of Politicians whose only experience of action is `Prime Ministers Question Time` no thanks.

Eddie
_________________
One thing i do know.I was blind but now i see.

VictoriaPlum · Joined: 16 Jan 2007 Posts: 718

I'm very glad they have been released, I don't see how they acted poorly, how differently could they have acted?

I don't see how they will be feted as heroes but certainly there will be interest for a time, that is only natural. I was pleased to see on the news that they looked none the worse for wear. I wouldn't have taken any pleasure in seeing them worn down, dirty and bedraggled. They weren't taken captive for very long so there wasn't time for much change in them, it still must have been pretty frightening when it happened.

If they had been treated badly, kept prisoner for months or years or even killed, what would it have been for?

Let's be glad they are free. I prayed for their freedom and was delighted to see them on the news last night. Yes, it was a stage managed affair but so what.

Talitha Tetelestai · Guest

4 more soldiers dead today. Icon_sad

jtheb · Joined: 21 Jun 2006 Posts: 1448 Location: second childhood

Not in Iran I hope.
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C.S.Craig

Talitha Tetelestai · Guest

In Iraq.

Janie · Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2007 1:02 pm Post subject:

I too come from a military background. Both my grandads fought in WW1, my Grandad Bryant (mum's dad) was gassed in the trenches and died 8 years after the war aged 39. My other Grandad was at the Battle of Ypres . My Nan had three sons (my dad included) and one grandson in WW2 and indeed my mum did her bit in the ATS as a driver assigned to the *higher ranks* Going back even further on my mum's side her grandad was a Captain in the British army and his dad was a Brigadier General in the British army in India.....ok that's my credentials. I would pray to God my own son would never be called up. I would rather die myself than see him go off to war. I loath war, but having said that when people join up in peacetime surely they must realise that their job is to go to war if called upon??. If they don't want to do that, then don't join up ! No one holds a gun to your head and says *You have to join the army/navy/airforce*.
I am no pacifist and I would defend my country to the death, but I do think the way things are nowadays we are getting more intrenched in situations that really have nothing to do with us.
Mark my words...Iraq/Iran will one day turn into our Vietnam.